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This week, host Gray Jones interviews Carole Kirschner, creator and director of the CBS Diversity Institute Writers Mentoring Program, and director of the Showrunner Training Program.

This episode is sponsored by Pilar Alessandra of Pilar is offering a 10% discount on her online “Writing TV” class, which runs Saturdays from July 11 – August 1. To get your 10% off, use the coupon code onthepage10 at checkout.

This is Carole Kirschner’s third appearance on the podcast — be sure to check out her first interview in episode 054, where she talked about her own career path through the industry and her excellent book, Hollywood Game Plan. Her second appearance was in Gray’s well attended panel at San Diego Comic-Con called “How to Write a TV Pilot,” in episode 085.

In this new interview, Carole reveals tons of great tips on how to stand out from the rest of the pack in your submissions to the CBS Diversity Writers Mentoring Program. Her advice is also applicable to the other writing fellowships, and college applications as well. She also has great tips on what makes or breaks writing samples, and shares at length about the Showrunner Training Program and the current state of the industry.

Having worked as a senior level television development executive for eighteen years (including her posts at CBS and as head of Steven Spielberg’s first Amblin Television), Carole has read over heard over 3,000 pitches, read more than 1,000 scripts, bought hundreds of projects and was involved in developing dozens of television series.

She is currently the Director of the Writers Guild of America’s Showrunner Training Program, the creator and Director of the CBS Diversity Writers Mentoring Program and is consulting with the Jewish Writers Initiative Program.

She’s also an author and international speaker. In her role as an entertainment career coach she helps aspiring writers, producers and directors navigate Hollywood as they break in and move up in the entertainment industry.

Her book, Hollywood Game Plan: How to Land a Job in Film, TV and Digital Entertainment, published by Michael Weise Publishers, is taught in film schools and universities around the country.

0:00 – Introduction
4:01 – Interview start, discussing how the industry has and hasn’t changed since she published Hollywood Game Plan 8 years ago. How she considers it easier to get your content produced, and social media is playing a bigger role.
8:20 – Main topic of interview — expanding on her Twitter thread discussing script submissions to CBS Diversity Institute Writers Mentoring Program. What is the program and why would someone want to apply for it?
12:15 – 6-8 are chosen each year from over 1,300 submissions. What will make your application stand out?
13:22 – How the letter of interest/personal essay is a writing sample.
19:30 – Story submissions – make it something only you can write, but universal.
22:02 – Need genuine life experience, not just being inspired from TV you’ve watched. Read other mediums, not just TV.
26:13 – What makes a compelling spec episode? Do stunt scripts work?
35:08 – Why stay within one genre? Finding your sweet spot and sticking to it. What will you bring to the room?
40:12 – How many are disqualified for not following instructions, and why?
42:53 – What is the track record of the program?
44:19 – Sponsor break.
45:30 – All about the Showrunner Training Program, moving from being a writer to a manager, delivering quality scripts on time. What does the program offer? Who is eligible?
52:40 – What is its track record?
56:41 – What is the landscape like for breaking in to television writing in 2020, virus aside? How she finds people aren’t working hard enough on their careers.
59:58 – How important is a college education now?
1:01:05 – How is COVID-19 changing the way someone might break in?
1:03:17 – Final advice and call to action.

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Buy Gray’s book for only $4.99! Look for it on Amazon – How To Break In To TV Writing: Insider Interviews.

Didn’t get your questions asked? Make sure you follow Gray on Twitter (@GrayJones) so you can get the scoop on who is being interviewed and how to get your questions in. Also check out our TV Writer Twitter Database to find Twitter addresses for over 1,200 TV writers. Find previous episodes and other resources at

PLEASE NOTE: we are now doing Tuesday releases, to line up with Script Magazine’s release dates.



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Author: Gray Jones

Graham “Gray” Jones is a seasoned TV editor/writer located in Valencia, California (on the northern outskirts of LA). He has an honors Screenwriting BFA from York University, where he graduated with distinction in 1994.

He hosted one of the world’s leading TV-themed podcasts, "Chuck vs. the Podcast," about NBC’s Chuck, and currently hosts the "TV Writer Podcast," in partnership with Script Magazine.

He runs several companies, including,, and Check them out!